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Log
Board Meeting
June 11, 2000
MS-Chat0001
6/11/00 1:03:48 PM,Nancy,Since Ron is very familiar with the Agenda, and I chatted on the phone with Shirley
just the other day and went over many of the items, I'd like to call the meeting to order to discuss the first 4
Agenda items and see if there are any questions.
6/11/00 1:04:12 PM,Nancy,The meeting will come to order. We anticipate a quorum and the arrival of Jurian and
Ron (who is connecting with Shirley)
6/11/00 1:04:31 PM,Jurian,Ah, there I am :)
6/11/00 1:04:36 PM,Jurian,I think
6/11/00 1:04:42 PM,Nancy,The first 4 Agenda items are primarily a report to the Board, so I'd like to ask if there
is any discussion or questions about Item 1.
6/11/00 1:05:48 PM,Nancy,There has been some discussion about earthworms, mostly with information from
Michel and from a web site that Ichi located (Canadian)
6/11/00 1:05:54 PM,Clipper,No questions here. It looks very organized.
6/11/00 1:06:00 PM,Jurian,None here either
6/11/00 1:06:06 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) No
6/11/00 1:06:12 PM,Gerard,For me no questions too
6/11/00 1:06:27 PM,Nancy,We have taken care to keep our nightcrawlers in their native soil, but Michel has
pointed out that red wrigglers break down compost more quickly. Perhaps we should be getting some of those
too.
6/11/00 1:07:26 PM,Ron,Hi all, had a hard time getting in.
6/11/00 1:07:41 PM,Jurian,Same here :-)
6/11/00 1:07:48 PM,Nancy,We are learning lessons on hydroponics, for instance the mix of plants is important
for compatibility, etc. They should all germinate same time (all are quick in any case) as the nutrient solution
needs to be changed apace. Also, from living with the worms, lessons are being learned.
6/11/00 1:08:17 PM,Nancy,Ron, Shirley has been in and out. Tried to send some messages. I think one of us
should call her on the phone, etc.
6/11/00 1:08:42 PM,Nancy,Do you want to come upstairs so we can free up a line?
6/11/00 1:09:21 PM,Ron,Yea, I guess so ... be there in a minute.
6/11/00 1:09:29 PM,Nancy,We have a lot of projects started, and it is my focus this summer to bring them all to
operational status, closure in that regard.
6/11/00 1:11:59 PM,Nancy,We have the worm beds in operation, hydroponics Cycle 1 coming along, short wave
pad under discussion with a contractor, storm shelter site being readied, and much under seed a'coming.
6/11/00 1:12:31 PM,Nancy,I want to ensure that our ongoing projects are OK before we start anything new.
6/11/00 1:13:39 PM,Nancy,New is wood gas prototype, houseboat demo, streaming audio/video development.
6/11/00 1:14:14 PM,Nancy,New also could be info from Clipper's concrete dome, which is being developed to
be pole shift sufficient.
6/11/00 1:14:44 PM,Nancy,Ron has computed the value of our physical assets and they come to about $11,000.
6/11/00 1:14:58 PM,Nancy,Any discusison on Item 1?
6/11/00 1:15:09 PM,Clipper,None here.
6/11/00 1:15:10 PM,Jurian,Stupid netmeeting is really starting to annoy me..
6/11/00 1:15:12 PM,Jurian,Nope none here
6/11/00 1:15:51 PM,Nancy,Next year, I'd like to see other hands doing the seed planting and collecting, as we
have the land and equipment (could use more land though), but not enough hands!
6/11/00 1:16:29 PM,Nancy,We also will be in a position to have more visiting professional helpers, with the
cottage now truly operational and cleaned up (and can open the windows!)
6/11/00 1:16:31 PM,Gerard,None here
6/11/00 1:17:33 PM,Nancy,It's so great having the place cleaned up and labs in operation (basement, etc.) as we
are now making real progress.
6/11/00 1:18:08 PM,Nancy,Along those lines, where we are looking now at what we have accomplished and
what is yet to be done, is there any discussion on Item 2, the proactive project list?
6/11/00 1:18:29 PM,Clipper,I would like to note that MikeL is also involved in the design and implementation of
the concrete dome.
6/11/00 1:18:53 PM,Nancy,We have gotten word that substantial funding might come our way. To date, we have
waited until a Principal offered their time, then put the project up for funding.
6/11/00 1:19:08 PM,Gerard,Personal question from Michel:
(Michel) Ask nancy if I'd be welcome to help out next year for a month or two..?
6/11/00 1:19:57 PM,Nancy,Now, this is reversed, with the funding coming ahead of the projects! So, I'm trying to
be more proactive, and have put out a list to tt-forum asking for ideas (only got them from MikeL, in fact) and
also onto tt-inc asking for review (only got an addition from Clipper).
6/11/00 1:21:59 PM,Nancy,For those who have read the Agenda, you can see that I am asking for Ichi's plane
fare to be reimbursed, some $800 or so per trip, for his time here to help out. I certainly would entertain an offer
from others in a similar manner! This is very cheap labor!
6/11/00 1:22:39 PM,Nancy,Japan has an arrangement with the US where a 3 month tourist visa is easy to get. Not
sure about other countries, but we have rooms here for those coming to work their butts off, etc. :-)
6/11/00 1:23:02 PM,Nancy,I even made our primary donor rake and plant and get out in the heat and sweat. No
one is exempt!
6/11/00 1:23:27 PM,Jurian,Question.. once our group starts working on our survival site, would it be possible to
get radio equipment from TT-inc funding? if possible, we could set up intercontinental communications between
our locations..
6/11/00 1:23:52 PM,Nancy,We need a vote on Item 2, before I can officially switch to this list from our old
format. There are new projects on this list, and per the Bylaws, we must have these approved by the Board. I'd
entertain a motion, etc.
6/11/00 1:24:26 PM,Nancy,Shirley states that she moves that we approve Item 2 as stated.
6/11/00 1:24:31 PM,Nancy,Ron seconds this motion.
6/11/00 1:24:59 PM,Nancy,A motion has been made and seconded to approve the project list as outlined in Item
2. All in favor say YES, opposed NO.
6/11/00 1:25:01 PM,Nancy,Yes
6/11/00 1:25:03 PM,Jurian,yes
6/11/00 1:25:06 PM,Clipper,Yes
6/11/00 1:25:13 PM,Nancy,Shirley and Ron, both yes
6/11/00 1:25:27 PM,Gerard,yes
6/11/00 1:25:58 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Yes
6/11/00 1:26:18 PM,Nancy,Item 3 of the Agenda is a simple report re the IRS status possibly calling our
nonprofit a private foundation vs public benefit. I frankly think there is scant chance of this for all the reasons
outlined in Agenda Item 3, but is seems even if this happens, the hit is on the donor, not us.
6/11/00 1:26:27 PM,Nancy,Nothing, in fact, would change for us.
6/11/00 1:26:51 PM,Nancy,The motion passes and the new project list is approved.
6/11/00 1:28:08 PM,Nancy,Item 4 is outlining what the reporting requirements are that I am aware of, to date.
Clipper's resignation has left us without a VP, but the Bylaws state that one is not strictly necessary, and in fact
the Board can appoint several if they wish.
6/11/00 1:28:35 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) what are the differences between the Inc as a private foundation and public benefit?
6/11/00 1:28:44 PM,Nancy,Should I be unable to function for more than a 30 day period, then a quorum of the
Board functions as a substitute President. So, you'all should be aware of the reporting requirements :-)
6/11/00 1:29:39 PM,Nancy,Michel, the IRS wants to prevent wealthy families from avoiding taxes by setting up
private foundations.
6/11/00 1:30:31 PM,Nancy,They then hire their family, have a stock portfolio where they don't have to pay taxes
on the dividents, and smirk behind the IRS's back.
6/11/00 1:31:17 PM,Nancy,So, if the IRS finds a nonprofit is functioning in this way, they limit the amount they
can personally give to this or that from 50% of their gross income to 30%, and make the nonprofit give away 5%
of their net worth every year!
6/11/00 1:31:40 PM,Nancy,For the recipient of a donation (us), there is no change :-)
6/11/00 1:32:51 PM,Nancy,I conferred with our CPA, and she stated that in most cases the IRS does not even
follow their rules, lets things slide by. In our case, where this donor is not on the Board, and our mission is not
changing since they started donating, I think the issue is mute.
6/11/00 1:33:22 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) So the Inc will not become a private organization I think, right?
6/11/00 1:33:34 PM,Nancy,Item 5 is a requested discussion on whether my view on the Binding Agreement is
considered correct by the Board.
6/11/00 1:34:23 PM,Nancy,As stated, if there is no chance of a NEW invention coming out, I have not been
requiring a binding agreement. Example: seed team growers are not asked to sign them, as they are NOT creating
new seed, only growing existing seed.
6/11/00 1:35:07 PM,Nancy,However, if a new invention is possible, in the case of Ron who is creative and
inventive and HAS patents in his name, or the case of Ichi who WILL be creating new recipes, I have required
this. Geson also agreed in writing.
6/11/00 1:36:33 PM,Nancy,Michel, unless we get a lot more donations, we WILL be considered a private
foundation from the major donor who is giving us $10,000 in January, and $15,000 now, and maybe up to
$50,000 in December. If more than 10% of a nonprofit is from a single source, the IRS can rule it is a private
foundation at the bidding of that source.
6/11/00 1:37:19 PM,Nancy,Question from your President. Do you thing my policy in demanding a Binding
Agreement is corect? Should I be more strict? Discussion and comment?
6/11/00 1:38:15 PM,Clipper,I think your binding agreement policy is fine.
6/11/00 1:38:40 PM,Nancy,While we are waiting for any comments on this Item 5, I'd like to also move to
discussion of Item 6. Ron is formulating a policy re the nonprofit's funding of short wave antenna towers and the
like - big ticket items, etc.
6/11/00 1:39:02 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) I don't understand it, so I can't comment.
6/11/00 1:39:35 PM,Nancy,He has been both pleased and disappointed with the response to his radio classes.
Good response re joining up, poor response re doing the grunt work, the reading and learning Morse Code and
the like.
6/11/00 1:39:59 PM,Nancy,We don't want to be seen as the place to go if you're looking for radio equipment just
because you show up!
6/11/00 1:40:30 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, how much antenna towers are needed and what will the educative value of this be exactly?
6/11/00 1:41:38 PM,Nancy,Michel, I would require you to sign one if you got funding, because you do creative
work. For instance, you could not take our funds, create something, then patent or copyright it for profit. The IRS
does not want a nonprofit to be used to support R&D for a for-profit enterprise. This is why that issue with Geoff
was such a sore point and I got out of tt-video so quickly! They do not mix, and we could lose our nonprofit
status.
6/11/00 1:42:22 PM,Nancy,The Binding Agreement states, simply, that the person getting money in any way from
the nonprofit for a project agrees that any patent or copyright or Trademark ensuing is the property of the
nonprofit, NOT the person.
6/11/00 1:42:36 PM,Nancy,Michel, I'd have to ask Ron.
6/11/00 1:43:35 PM,Nancy,Ron says - we need as many towers as we have trained operators, and the short wave
internet replacement procedures.
6/11/00 1:44:00 PM,Nancy,Ron states - and we want to place them in as many parts of the world as we can get
these operators.
6/11/00 1:44:50 PM,Nancy,Ron says - if you can pay for your own tower, wonderful! In those cases, the
nonprofit may purchase an amplifier for the person.
6/11/00 1:45:48 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) To what extent will funding be pushed to be used for basically preparation at the Inc. site? Basically, when the poleshift hits - the Inc. site will have been made into a prepared survival site with all the necessary necessaries to survive paid by funds. I do not like this idea when there is nothing in it for the other board members of the Inc.
6/11/00 1:45:49 PM,Nancy,Nancy says - depends on the funds the nonprofit gets, the other demands for the funds,
but per Ron it ALSO depends on the quality of the operators. He wants blood and sweat from those folks FIRST,
in the web lessons and IRC and the like, before they get funding.
6/11/00 1:47:07 PM,Nancy,Michel, I quite agree with you and this is one reason the storm shelter will NOT be
cemeted down but can easily be moved. ALL nonprofit assets can be moved, and in fact may. Do you know of
another site where a lab such as we are operating in the basement can be housed? NO other offers have been
made, to date.
6/11/00 1:47:42 PM,Nancy,Also, this place is very public, the address known to the world (an IRS and other
requirement), so just what kind of a survival site do you think this will be?
6/11/00 1:48:45 PM,Nancy,My focus has been on developing solutions, getting these fine tuned so that the public
does not make mistakes when they have little funds or time. Getting this out in written word (brochures) or videos
or the Internet (streaming video). Many many interviews, etc.
6/11/00 1:50:19 PM,Nancy,Michel, in NO way do the Board members or officers get ANY benefit from the
nonprofit assets! I have spent all my funds, and put all my personal assets at the disposal of, the Inc. My home is
invaded, my time completely consumed, and I know of NO other members who have done this short of Ron who
has worked full time on these projects!
6/11/00 1:50:52 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, whether all items paid by funds can be moved or not does not matter if they will eventually be used by you or Ron or another present member of the Inc to survive while the other board members have nothing - in most cases. They have nothing to offer for they have in most cases nothing. Wouldn't the Inc. be able to co-fund property for building such a lab on, for instance?
6/11/00 1:51:24 PM,Nancy,Please compare my and Ron's contribution, and personal sacrifice, to all others!
Plus, where we have repeatedly stated this is NOT a survival site, others murmur this! Those others who so
murmur should be looked at for THEIR agenda, frankly, how much they have contributed and what they are
looking for, personally.
6/11/00 1:52:03 PM,Nancy,There is, to my knowledge, one source of this view. No more grousing on this matter
publically. Lets take this off line unless it is professional.
6/11/00 1:52:57 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Your focus on developing solutions is in fact getting you prepared for the shift.. ergo your requests and that of Ron to buy this and that for use AT the Inc. site.. that is in fact BENEFITING YOU AND RON, members of the Inc.
6/11/00 1:53:09 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Ron has worked full time because he had the time, he said so himself before his heavy contributing began.
6/11/00 1:53:25 PM,Nancy,Michel, buy the land so someone can setup a lab? If the person had the track record
such that they could be counted upon to DELIVER, certainly this would be an option. Please give me examples!
6/11/00 1:54:18 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, I see this as a matter important to the Inc. You call it unprofessional, and to be honest I have spoken about this with both Jurian and Gerard.
6/11/00 1:55:24 PM,Nancy,Let's take the projects, one by one. Where in the world is lab work on growing
hydroponics with urine and worm pee and the pH and the like able to grow tomatoes when no nutrient powder
can be purchased. Are YOU going to do this? WHO?
6/11/00 1:56:36 PM,Nancy,My husband is spending days of his time assembling Linux servers. YOU on the other
hand have had the Pole Shift video proposal out there for years, and NOT moved it along with your time. He
works long days, full time, what is your excuse? This is an example of these complaints!
6/11/00 1:57:07 PM,Nancy,Ron says - this is a matter that is not appropriate for the Board Meeting, was not on
the agenda, and should be taken to tt-inc for discussion. Lets move on.
6/11/00 1:57:18 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, that was an example, as I made clear. The point is, will all funds be used at the Inc. site only?
6/11/00 1:57:20 PM,Clipper,I agree
6/11/00 1:58:06 PM,Clipper,I agree with Ron I mean. We should move on.
6/11/00 1:58:14 PM,Nancy,Michel, Ron is not in a differnt position from you. He needs to work to live, and gave
UP much which you do NOT give up so he can work on these projects. You just give excuses, frankly!
6/11/00 1:59:15 PM,Gerard,
(Jurian) It's not as easy to buy land in Europe as it seems to be in the US, land here is generally very expensive, and none of our group currently have the resources to buy land, let alone set up an entire survival site.. Any help from the Inc to at least START a site in Europe, would be a good begin for us, and it'd make it possible for us ALL to start setting up the worldwide HAM network..
6/11/00 1:59:48 PM,Gerard,
(Jurian) I'm not saying the Inc should buy us a bunch of land, but helping funding stuff like the radio tower(s) and other equipment, would be a good thing in my opinion. Now maybe I'm missing something here, in that case, sorry.. I'm only 19 years old, dont know everything yet :-)
6/11/00 1:59:50 PM,Nancy,Michel, this I heard from Clipper when he wanted to fund his survival site in Alaska.
Clipper has NOT developed any prototypes, but now needs money for his site so suddenly offers. Has his time
changed? No, same demands. His comment was, when I pointed out that funds were not to be used unless they
could deliver, that he felt that only headquarters projects would be funded.
6/11/00 2:00:52 PM,Nancy,Now, lets look at the 1997-1998 time frame. I didn't have a home, was renting in
California, and ALL projects were being funded wherever they appeared! Geson got funded. Michel would have
if he had been willing to work on this project. NO one else came forward!
6/11/00 2:00:54 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, you are being quite rude. You act as if you know how I live my life, what I do and don't. The fact that I don't contribute makes me a lesser value than Ron (by your example and statement we must believe so). I have other things I am quite busy with.. should I report to you with what?
6/11/00 2:01:31 PM,Clipper,I have since ended my discusion about this topic. I see Nancy's and the Inc's point of
view. Clearly.
6/11/00 2:01:36 PM,Nancy,One looks, when hiring for a job or whatever, at past track record. If nothing came in
the past, then hot air or promises mean little.
6/11/00 2:02:42 PM,Nancy,Jurian, yes, radio towers are an example. Please note that in Item 6, short wave
policy, that Ron and I are BOTH suggesting that Shirley be a recipient of a tower! She lives a long long way from
us, and after the pole shift where would be no travel there either, from here!
6/11/00 2:04:01 PM,Nancy,I think this demonstrates that this point being raised by Michel, based on, I have no
doubt, Clipper's complaints about his funding of his survival site efforts, is baseless. If off-site funding is NOT
my goal, then how did the early projects get funded, and why are we recommending Shirley get an antenna?
6/11/00 2:04:18 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, then Jurian should be optionally become a recipient of a tower too?
6/11/00 2:04:26 PM,Nancy,This disproves this carping complaint, which is based on personal sore point and
NOT because it has a basis.
6/11/00 2:04:52 PM,Nancy,Jurian, absolutely. Has he done the ground work that Ron is looking for? We very
much need an European antenna.
6/11/00 2:05:49 PM,Nancy,A CEO is required to move projects along. NOT to panper hurt feelings. I'd like to
point out that you raised this discussion by pointing a finger at me, and I defended myself.
6/11/00 2:06:10 PM,Clipper,Just to clarify one point. I have discussed the funding of our concrete dome with no
one but MikeL.
6/11/00 2:06:16 PM,Nancy,Ron says - point of order!
6/11/00 2:06:58 PM,Nancy,Ron says - this discussion belongs on tt-inc and must cease immediately at this Board
Meeting. It is NOT on the agenda. Any further discussion should be ignored by the Chairperson.
6/11/00 2:07:08 PM,Nancy,Nancy says - I quite agree, and will stick to the agenda.
6/11/00 2:07:11 PM,Gerard,
(Jurian) I don't have a license yet, as soon as I get the financial means, I'll work on getting that. Reading up on HAM radio tech stuff, and electronics in general.
6/11/00 2:08:45 PM,Nancy,Agenda item 5 is acceptance of $1,798 from Nicholas Kobusch personally and
$15,000 from his family foundation. We have received the first and deposited it, and anticipate receiving the
$15,000 as the attorneys required some documention from us first.
6/11/00 2:09:56 PM,Nancy,They want to be sure we are what we say, are where we say we are, had a report
from an on-site visitor, and you can be sure that our backgrounds were researched! This is WHY funds are put
into hands that can be trusted to deliver, and no repeat of the Diana situation where $1,500 disappeared and was
recovered only after prosecution, occurs!
6/11/00 2:10:11 PM,Nancy,Jurian, good for you!
6/11/00 2:11:13 PM,Nancy,Ron - I move that we accept the funds outlined in Item 7, $16,798, from the donors.
Nancy's note, there were no conditions attached to this funding.
6/11/00 2:11:25 PM,Nancy,A second?
6/11/00 2:11:32 PM,Clipper,I second
6/11/00 2:12:04 PM,Nancy,A motion has been made and seconded to accept the $16,798 from donors. All in
favor say YES, opposed NO.
6/11/00 2:12:06 PM,Nancy,yes
6/11/00 2:12:10 PM,Nancy,Ron - yes
6/11/00 2:12:12 PM,Clipper,Yes
6/11/00 2:12:14 PM,Nancy,Shirley - yes
6/11/00 2:13:08 PM,Gerard,yes
6/11/00 2:14:13 PM,Gerard,
(Jurian) yes
6/11/00 2:14:15 PM,Nancy,While we're waiting for Michel and Jurian (Jurian lost the NetMeeting connection)
I'd like to move to discussion on disbursement issues.
6/11/00 2:14:20 PM,Nancy,The motion passes.
6/11/00 2:15:18 PM,Gerard,Michel hadn't give an answer yet
6/11/00 2:16:14 PM,Nancy,As I noted in the Agenda update posted yesterday and noticed to the Board via tt-inc,
we have $14,676.65 in funds that can be disbursed. This is assuming that certain items approved by the Board
will NOT be spent over the next 6 months. Geson's clip was duplicated and another $500 in case we needed
more dups, but the demand has been light so probably that $500, this year, will not be required!
6/11/00 2:17:56 PM,Nancy,The $14,676 takes into account approved expenses that WILL be spent, in my view.
When we approved the Minor/Maint allowance account in April, it was stated that funding was not available to
cover all. However, to proceed with the Worm Beds, for instance, we had to buy many items not anticipated, and
having this fund was very much needed to not impact progress!
6/11/00 2:20:04 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, since I don't have any access no longer to the right equipment to produce material and scenes for a video I'd like to retreat from that. Please remove me as such from the Inc. site where this proposal is concerned. I need to put my time and energy - as I have done so in the past - in earning money for my European group. I'm really sorry.
6/11/00 2:20:22 PM,Nancy,I have outlined what I feel is necessary to complete ongoing projects, and to balance
in all fairness. Worm Bed project required the purchase of a table saw and mitre saw, assets of the nonprofit
which can be repeatedly used on many projects and can be MOVED to another site. This project used all the
minor/maint allowance and MORE.
6/11/00 2:21:21 PM,Nancy,Michel, your request will be honored! We may have a Silicon Graphics computer
here, a slight chance, and if you could come for a couple months and work on it HERE, that would be great!
6/11/00 2:23:11 PM,Nancy,I'd like to see, first off, a balance to Clipper getting reimbursed for $855 in travel for
a few days effort, Roger's gas and meals on the road for his week of assistance (both efforts were very much
appreciated!) with Ichi's dual visits of 3 months each. This he paid for out of his own pocket, and is a very hard
worker! In fairness, his travel expenses should be reimbursed!
6/11/00 2:24:07 PM,Clipper,I agree
6/11/00 2:25:26 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, I thank you for your invitation and will consider it. I advise though you hire a professional 3d animator/student animator from a college and pay them from the funds to make a professional animation. Students don't ask lots of money and are in most cases happy with the work, the pay, the food and the bed
6/11/00 2:25:54 PM,Nancy,As mentioned, we overran the $250 in minor expenses for Worm Beds by $440. I
want another $500 for that account, $60 extra for unforseen. A hydroponics and fish tank oversight in estimating
the initial costs, was de-humidifiers. Ron sees mold setting in NOW, and the several gallons of transpiration/day
has not yet started. A basement has no ventilation, etc. Dehumidifiers, which can be MOVED as can the
hydroponics and fish tanks and worm beds, will also gain pure distilled water, needed for hydroponics actually.
6/11/00 2:26:28 PM,Nancy,Michel, a very good suggestion! This is just coming together, and I will need your
advice on this frequently!
6/11/00 2:27:08 PM,Nancy,Since I'm outlining many suggested expenditures, perhaps we should vote on these as
we go along, rather than as a whole.
6/11/00 2:30:06 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, if you want advice from me you can always contact me via email.. michel@davelaar.com or if necessary via the tt-inc. of course
6/11/00 2:31:53 PM,Nancy,I'd entertain a motion to approve Ichi's travel expenses and fund the ongoing worm
bed and hydroponic projects (also included is reimbursement for $100 in lumber for the outhouse demo, which
can be MOVED to another site I'd like to add!). This is altogether a bit under $3,000.
6/11/00 2:32:38 PM,Clipper,I make a motion we approve the items as listed
6/11/00 2:33:22 PM,Nancy,While we're waiting for this, motion to vote or not, etc., I'll move along to the next
item suggested. This is a CHANGE from the past project, but a GOOD change as it makes the storm shelter more
in keeping with our policy that funding should only be for solution sets, not silly or just a purchased item.
6/11/00 2:33:33 PM,Nancy,Shirley seconds the motion.
6/11/00 2:34:50 PM,Nancy,A motion has been made and seconded to approve disbursement of funds to
reimburse Ichi his travel expenses, increase the worm bed allowance by $500, purchase de-humidifiers,
reimburse $100 for outhouse demo - total under $3,000. All in favor say YES, opposed NO.
6/11/00 2:34:52 PM,Nancy,Yes.
6/11/00 2:34:56 PM,Nancy,Shirley - yes
6/11/00 2:34:58 PM,Clipper,Yes
6/11/00 2:35:00 PM,Nancy,Ron - yes
6/11/00 2:35:44 PM,Gerard,yes
6/11/00 2:36:13 PM,Nancy,The storm shelter was originally called a bermed hut with metal roof, as I thought (in
my naïveté) that the old barn foundation would only need a tin roof for a couple hundred bucks. Then the White's
donated specified $2,000 for this, and I got estimates.
6/11/00 2:36:46 PM,Nancy,The foundation would take $8,000 to be repaired, per a stone mason, and the roof
was coming up about $5,000 no matter how we tacked at this.
6/11/00 2:36:50 PM,Nancy,No way!
6/11/00 2:37:17 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) I do not approve the travel expenses, but I do approve the other items and give them a firm yes
6/11/00 2:37:59 PM,Gerard,
(Jurian) yes
6/11/00 2:38:16 PM,Nancy,Ron suggested that some pre-fab storm shelters might fit this bill, and the cost was
certainly closer to the donation. However, this was just an off-the-shelf purchase, and this bothered me big time.
6/11/00 2:38:35 PM,Nancy,The motion to approve Ichi's travel expenses, etc., passed.
6/11/00 2:39:16 PM,Nancy,Ron came up with some good ideas. If we got a metal shelter instead of the cheapest
concrete, then several pole shift modifications could be done.
6/11/00 2:39:55 PM,Nancy,1. the concrete shelter has a vent that would suck out all the oxygen in a firestorm, but
the metal one could be adjusted to have a close-able valve.
6/11/00 2:40:34 PM,Nancy,2. the concrete shelter could not have seats or belts attached, but the metal could have
metal seats welded, seat belts, helmets could be worm, etc. for quakes.
6/11/00 2:41:26 PM,Nancy,This made the expenditure more acceptable, especially as there has been MUCH
discussion on the tt-forum re burrying a VW bug and using set belts, having oxygen tanks handy, etc. for the shift.
6/11/00 2:43:35 PM,Nancy,However, this metal shelter, which I intend to place as much ABOVE ground as not,
and NOT anchor with concrete so it could be MOVED to another site, would cost another $1,000, and the travel
is a bit more expensive. Without this approval, we are yet again stuck on what to do with the White's $2,000 in
designated donation. The metal shelter is bermed, with a metal roof, and is as specified in the original a way to
avoid winds, firestorm, etc.
6/11/00 2:44:48 PM,Nancy,Shirley states - because we are an eduational center, we should be able to show
videos and photos that are uniquely suitable for pole shift conditions as opposed to burrying an off-the-shelf
shelter.
6/11/00 2:45:06 PM,Nancy,I would entertain a motion on this item as a stand alone issue.
6/11/00 2:45:46 PM,Clipper,I make a motion we approve the metal shelter as listed
6/11/00 2:46:25 PM,Nancy,Shirley says -I second the motion to approve this item as stated in Item 7 of the
Agenda.
6/11/00 2:46:25 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, can you put up copied scans of receits etc. of purcxhased items by the inc.?
6/11/00 2:48:38 PM,Nancy,Ron says - Michel, this is not required, and is too much work. We have an audit firm
(CPA). As a Board Member you are encouraged to walk in and review the books at any time. Or, you can send in
a proxy to view these books and puruse the receipts.
6/11/00 2:49:27 PM,Nancy,A motion has been made and seconded to approve the storm shelter changes (about
$1,500) as stated in Agenda Item 7. All in favor say YES, opposed NO.
6/11/00 2:50:10 PM,Clipper,Yes
6/11/00 2:50:22 PM,Gerard,yes
6/11/00 2:51:30 PM,Gerard,
(Jurian) yes
(Michel) substain
6/11/00 2:51:44 PM,Nancy,Nancy wants to note that the Bylaws specify audits, or reviews by the Board, which
is altogether encouraged! Also, the State of Wisconsin requires a formal audit by a CPA firm of any nonprofit that
exceeds $100,000 in a year. We may, in fact, reach that this year! This audit looks at receipts, checks that folks
received the checks that were sent to them, double checks everything, and costs several thousand dollars! So, we
are and have been an open book!
6/11/00 2:52:29 PM,Nancy,Ron and Shirley both vote Yes
6/11/00 2:52:32 PM,Nancy,Nancy votes Yes
6/11/00 2:52:48 PM,Nancy,The motion passes. Michel abstains.
6/11/00 2:55:06 PM,Nancy,The next item of disbursement is something I addressed in April, compensating some
VERY hard and heavy workers for their MASSIVE time spent on nonprofit projects. There has been some
grousing about this, so I took some pains to document the time spent, on what projects (and photos document that
the time was actually spent!) between all who could be considered for compensation.
6/11/00 2:55:58 PM,Nancy,Ron is not here because he is wealthy, he is here because he has decided not to have
a life, and room in a spider-ridden chicken coop for a hot (no AC and no windows that could open) summer
getting these project going!
6/11/00 2:57:26 PM,Nancy,Nancy could have done other things with her time, after a full time job and all else
being juggled, but spent several weeks SUCCESSFULLY getting 1023 forms into the IRS and other things not
easily done. Attorney's are usually hired for these matters, plus CPA firms.
6/11/00 2:58:21 PM,Nancy,Geson did a professional job not only on the nonprofit home page, but on the TV film
clip, which he received $$ for ONLY after he had delivered, etc. I think the $1,000 I suggested is only 1/25 of
what this would cost if one were to go to a PR firm, for instance.
6/11/00 2:59:11 PM,Nancy,I put the list of who did what, comparison time, out for the April meeting, on the
tt-inc, and as a link off this agenda. I asked for comments. Other than a bit of grousing from those not being
suggested for compensation, nothing was said.
6/11/00 2:59:20 PM,Nancy,Is there any discussion on this now?
6/11/00 2:59:50 PM,Clipper,None here
6/11/00 2:59:53 PM,Nancy,I'd like to point out that most nonprofits hire people, when they must put in these
hours. People costs are right up there with equipment costs.
6/11/00 3:00:09 PM,Gerard,none here
6/11/00 3:00:22 PM,Nancy,Nonprofits have staff, as these folks must eat, and get insurance, and occasionally buy
a pair of pants, etc.
6/11/00 3:00:48 PM,Nancy,We'd rather have volunteers, always, who are wealthy and don't need compensation,
but lets get real!
6/11/00 3:01:55 PM,Nancy,I'd entertain discussion of this matter, have for the past 2 months made quite an effort
to put this out and get discussion going on tt-inc and the like, brought this up before the Board 2 months ago for
this reason, and no discussion other than a bit of grousing has occurred.
6/11/00 3:02:13 PM,Nancy,If no discussion evolves, I'd entertain a motion on this matter.
6/11/00 3:05:09 PM,Nancy,Shirley moves that compensation be approved as outlined in Agenda Item 7.
6/11/00 3:05:20 PM,Clipper,I make a motion that we approve items as listed
6/11/00 3:05:57 PM,Nancy,A motion has been twice made (moved and seconded) to approve compensation as
outlined in Agenda Item 7. All in favor say YES, opposed NO.
6/11/00 3:05:58 PM,Nancy,yes
6/11/00 3:06:06 PM,Nancy,Shirley - Yes
6/11/00 3:06:09 PM,Clipper,Yes
6/11/00 3:06:14 PM,Nancy,Ron - yes
6/11/00 3:07:22 PM,Gerard,yes
6/11/00 3:07:46 PM,Nancy,While waiting for the votes to come in, I'd like to put out an appeal to the Board
Members about gathering content for brochures and videos and the streaming video servers. We are looking for
folks who know of, or can go personally and video or photograph, prototypes that are working and operational!
6/11/00 3:09:00 PM,Nancy,For instance, I've appealed to Jay in Boise Idaho re his windmill expertise. Asked
him if he could video his stuff, or help us document the gist of what he can offer (kW per type of windmill, and
how to make a windmill from paper cups or whatever :-)
6/11/00 3:09:48 PM,Nancy,Do you folks know of special prototypes nearby YOU, and can you help gather this
content? We would certainly give credits where requested, etc.!
6/11/00 3:10:14 PM,Clipper,I will keep my eyes open.
6/11/00 3:10:16 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, I can come and film the prototypes at the inc. but anybody else could do this. All that is needed is a steady hand and some visual insight.
6/11/00 3:10:44 PM,Gerard,vote from Michel:
(Michel) yes
6/11/00 3:11:03 PM,Gerard,Jurian:
(Jurian) yes
6/11/00 3:11:22 PM,Nancy,Michel, you seem to know a lot about earthworms, for instance. Are there earthworm
growers near you? Do you know of any hydroelectric examples? We don't have water generation nearby here,
and could go to Pelton Wheel, I suppose, but .. this is the type of thing I'm looking for.
6/11/00 3:11:31 PM,Nancy,The motion passes and compensation is approved.
6/11/00 3:12:58 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, I am going to start worm breeding over here this year. I'd like to film that. Once I have the money (in two months perhaps if I am lucky because I have debts to pay) I could buy a moviecam for this. I could convert the movie to digital format and make a real video from it for streaming video showing the wormbreeding progress.
6/11/00 3:14:16 PM,Nancy,The last issue in Item 7 is remaining funds from the donations recently received. I
have not covered insurance for the nonprofit assets which are housed here, nor getting welding equipment which
is needed to modify the (cheap) cow tanks we got (as the 86" wide round fish tank would not go into the
basement, nor could it be MOVED). I am in the process of getting insurance estimates, to cover loss and liability.
Ron also is getting estimates re welding equipment. We could wait until the July meeting to get specific on these
two items.
6/11/00 3:15:36 PM,Nancy,Michel, if you are going to be an ALTERNATE site, the nonprofit could certainly
fund your expenses re worm beds! You seem to have researched this very thoroughtly! This is a lab in your home!
Let's talk about this off line.
6/11/00 3:16:02 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, hydroelectric devices I know not much about. As for worms, yes, I have always been an A student when it comes to biology. I have read several meaningful websites on wormbreeding and have given Ron one url of a website with a lot of helpfull information.
6/11/00 3:16:30 PM,Nancy,Ron says - if Michel's approach to growing earthworms is sufficiently different from
what is being done currently at the Inc headquarters, then this should be discussed on tt-inc and if it merits
funding, should be funded.
6/11/00 3:16:52 PM,Gerard,Aron just joined
6/11/00 3:17:08 PM,Nancy,Nancy says - I think a second soil/worm type and results as to what makes them grow
the best (statistics and the like) would be VERY helpful. You would be only the 2nd site!
6/11/00 3:17:40 PM,Nancy,We are also looking for statistics on how the worm pee (from watering the beds)
supports indoor growing.
6/11/00 3:18:47 PM,Nancy,As long as Aron is here, I'd like to address, briefly, the last discussion item on the
Agenda Item 7 - video camera and digitizing camera.
6/11/00 3:19:22 PM,Nancy,Aron, Ichi's camera is here with him, and Ron's documentation on the worm beds and
hydroponics is an example of using this camera. We're hooked!
6/11/00 3:19:48 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, I have two medium sized containers (for keeping plants and it has a plastic see through lid etc.) (90 cm x 40 cm x 50 cm I think).. these are perfect as I am currently not using them for anything else (except for the buckweed in the left container)..
6/11/00 3:20:15 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, the worm pee is called vemiculite. From what I have understood, it drains throug the soil to the bottom of the container where you can collect it.
6/11/00 3:20:16 PM,Nancy,Also, my video camera is busy documenting the steps we are taking, especially
where this is very different from what anyone else would be doing (the space blanket to raise the temp is a first,
to my knowledge).
6/11/00 3:20:43 PM,Nancy,Also, Aron, can you work with a Silicon Graphics machine, or with Toonz software?
6/11/00 3:21:03 PM,Nancy,Nicholas may be able to send these things our way!
6/11/00 3:21:30 PM,Nancy,Michel, you've become an expert! :-)
6/11/00 3:22:37 PM,Nancy,Michel, where did you come upon the info re reg wrigglers vs crawlers? I have been
looking around, and we are thinking that we need MORE that the massive crawlers that abound around here in
Wisco. Can you give me a source, etc?
6/11/00 3:22:42 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, no.. I need to become an expert by aplying my knowledge and learn from experience.
6/11/00 3:23:12 PM,Nancy,Michel, it's the blind leading the blind here, to some degree. You're a relative expert,
etc.
6/11/00 3:24:23 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, I can email you a url of a website from which you can even order a worm-colony.
6/11/00 3:24:57 PM,Nancy,What we're trying to do, in my opinion, is get a tight solution set where we can state
to panic'd people that if they do x/y/z that they will get results a/b/c. For instance, if you run out of hyroponic
powder, and need to use urine, worm um pee (vermiculite), or some wood ashes in water to substitute - does this
work? Does it work only for a time, then everyone's teeth fall out?
6/11/00 3:25:16 PM,Nancy,Michel, thanks!
6/11/00 3:25:31 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) Nancy, after the chat I will send you an email with information. Ok?
6/11/00 3:26:30 PM,Nancy,I have a plan on the web re the worm beds and hydroponic and fish tanks, with how
quickly I hope to move to these steps. We'll all be eating Japanese noodles soon enought, so if our teeth fall out,
we'll let you know!
6/11/00 3:26:59 PM,Nancy,If there is no further business to address, I'd entertain a motion to adjourn.
6/11/00 3:27:22 PM,Clipper,I make a motion to adjourn
6/11/00 3:28:48 PM,Nancy,I noted several things that are additional business, pending, at the end of Item 7. For
instance, we are getting down to nitty-gritties re installing the antenna for short wave. Seems a soil test is
required, to determine how big the pad needs to be, for instance. This soil test costs $1,500! However, this
would be the case, I suspect, for each antenna we install at nonprofit costs.
6/11/00 3:29:01 PM,Gerard,
(Aron) NO I don't know about graphics
(Aron) Sorry for the delay in replying
6/11/00 3:29:27 PM,Nancy,A motion to adjourn has been made and (essentially) seconded. All in favor say
YES, opposed say NO.
6/11/00 3:29:29 PM,Nancy,yes
6/11/00 3:29:37 PM,Nancy,Shirley - yes
6/11/00 3:29:40 PM,Nancy,Ron - yes
6/11/00 3:29:40 PM,Clipper,Yes
6/11/00 3:29:55 PM,Gerard,yes
6/11/00 3:30:31 PM,Gerard,
(Aron) Since I missed it all yes
6/11/00 3:31:13 PM,Gerard,
(Michel) yes
6/11/00 3:31:46 PM,Nancy,The motion passes. Meeting is adjourned.